Prof. Tullia Catalan works at the University of Trieste (Italy), one of the partners of the University of Silesia in Transform4Europe alliance. During the first meetings, when the concept of common European university project was being developed, she got to know Assoc. Prof. Małgorzata Myśliwiec, Professor of the University of Silesia, and Assoc. Prof. Tomasz Pietrzykowski, Professor of the University of Silesia. As a result of joint discussions, the Italian researcher was invited to the University of Silesia.

Prof. Tullia Catalan offered to give a monographic lecture on the analysis and comparison of Upper Adriatic and Upper Silesia from the perspective of public history („Public History and Border Regions. Collective Memories in the Upper Adriatic and Silesia”). In the meantime, the coronavirus pandemic broke out around the world, and had a significant impact e.g. on the operation of universities. Therefore, the classes were held entirely online.

‘Although the monographic lecture was not organised under Transform4Europe, our alliance was the source of it. Due to the difficult situation that the whole world found itself in, we were able to test an important kind of cooperation based only on distance learning. Therefore, I would like to share my observations. There are many challenges for us’, commented the scientist from the University of Trieste.

We encourage you to read the interview with Prof. Tullia Catalan, in which she tells e.g. about the similarities and differences in running classes in Italy and Poland during the pandemic, and about building relationships with students in this difficult time.

Dr Małgorzata Kłoskowicz: Professor, you are the author of a monographic lecture on the border regions of Upper Adriatic and Upper Silesia, prepared for students of political science at the University of Silesia. I must admit that this is rather an unusual “geographic” connection…

Prof. Tullia Catalan: I’m a historian, employee of the University of Trieste. I specialise in Jewish studies, racism-related phenomena and ethnic minorities, especially in the context of border regions. While we were working in a wider, international group, I had the pleasure to meet Prof. Małgorzata Myśliwiec and Prof. Tomasz Pietrzykowski from the University of Silesia. We talked about our scientific interests. They found that the subject I focus on could be interesting for students of the Polish university. This is why they invited me to cooperate. I agreed and prepared a series of meetings on comparing border regions and collective memories of inhabitants of Upper Adriatic and Upper Silesia. Let me also add that there had been no pandemic at that point. I thought that I’d be able to come to Poland, to Katowice. I was hoping to get to know the city, its buildings, museums, monuments and streets with students, to read the urban space from the perspective of public history, which is very close to me. The later events changed the plan a lot, but I did not give up the cooperation. We decided to test the form of lectures fully based on the distance learning rules.

M.K.: So can we talk about the similarities and differences in running classes with students in Trieste and in Katowice from the perspective of challenges that occurred during the coronavirus pandemic?

T.C.: I think that our students got used to working with using various mobile devices and apps. However, they are active mainly in the area related to spending free time nicely. When they meet during an online lecture or classes, nobody wants to show their face or speak. I’m sometimes under the impression that I talk to a black screen, I only see initials or avatars, and I’m not sure if anyone listens to what I say. This is something that Polish and Italian students have in common.

There is, however, one significant difference that I want to highlight.

In Italy I had the possibility to meet my students directly, which was of key importance for building our relationships. I know what they look like, and we got to know one another a bit. Then it was easier for me to address them directly during online classes. I knew their names and remembered their faces. Unfortunately, I did not have this possibility in Poland, because the lecture was delivered during the winter semester of the academic year in progress, when all classes were carried out online. Please imagine that I was giving the lecture without seeing the faces or hearing the voice of my audience. It’s very difficult to build any relationship between the lecturer and students in such conditions.

M.K.: Why are students so unwilling to show their faces or speak during a lecture or classes?

T.C.: There are many reasons for that. At the University of Trieste all online meetings are recorded. This is why young people are not willing to comment on the subject of classes. They do not want to publish their image either. I do understand this argument, although it does not apply to Polish students, whose classes are not recorded. I think that some of them do not want to show their houses or flats. Many of them also say that they have technical problems with the Internet connection, and with video cameras switched on, there may be disruptions that make the meetings difficult. This is also true.

The English language is definitely a barrier. If my Italian students don’t want to speak in their native language, then why would Polish students want to speak a foreign one… I don’t know what their level of English is. I try to speak slowly, use presentations to help me, and I’m not a native speaker of English. I believe that they understand what I say to them. However, there is something that makes them silent.

M.K.: What does it mean for our future joint actions under Transform4Europe project?

T.C.: The last few months were for us a valuable lesson for us in the context of designing common directions for the future within Transform4Europe, which, to a large extent, will be conducted online. When the pandemic is over, I would suggest organising at least one direct meeting of the lecturer with students, as far as this is possible, so that we have the opportunity to get to know one another. This will really make it easier to conduct distance classes and lectures later on.

I would also consider introducing the obligation for students participating in classes to turn their online cameras on. We may try to provide them with technical support to avoid problems with Internet connection.

Moreover, we should apply certain methods to activate students, so that they want to talk, especially in a foreign language. Let me add that Transform4Europe will allow both employees and students to develop their language competencies. I cannot imagine a whole semester of silence.

Let’s talk to students and develop solutions together. This is one of inherent Transform4Europe elements, and my recommendation.

M.K.: Transform4Europe also means the possibility of strong cooperation with the region…

T.C.: What I teach students in Italy is mainly public history. This scientific discipline enables us to look at the regions surrounding us through historic monuments, street names, museums, monuments, public holidays, festivals etc. I study the way the community inhabiting a specific area represents itself. This is a very interesting research area. We would like the university graduates not only to work as teachers or journalists, but also to act as advisors in local and national units that have a real impact on shaping the future of their region and country. Such activities are intended to strengthen Transform4Europe alliance.

In the first question you pointed to the unusual “geographic” connection of the regions that do not have a lot in common at first sight. I look at them from the perspective of historic and social changes. This is why I can notice various similarities, which have become the subject of my monographic lecture. In particular, these are border regions, although the very notion of “border” can be understood broadly. It is not only about the geographic meaning, but also the social one – invisible, more difficult to capture, concerning the identity, ideology, nationalisms, coexistence of creeds, multilingualism, migrations etc. This is all stored in the memory of city inhabitants, its physical presence, in the buildings and monuments that either still exist or were “wiped out”, demolished, moved. If we know the past, we may better understand the presence and design the future.

It is precisely in such border regions that the leader of our consortium, Saarland University, noticed a unique opportunity, which we will try to use precisely within Transform4Europe project.

This special type of cooperation is mainly intended to develop the skills and competencies of students, open-minded people, who will use their knowledge in practice in the future. They will work in different institutions. They will be experts. Many of my Italian students are convinced that what we have achieved in our country, for example in the context of the existing rights, will last forever. Well, it won’t. The history may change, and we should be aware of it.

I also think that students from various European countries don’t know anything about one another. Transform4Europe project opens up the possibility for my students to see what studies look like across Europe, not only in Italy. We will definitely have to find a way to get them interested in this subject, to make them want to meet young people from other countries. It won’t be easy. I think that this is another challenge out of multiple challenges faced by all European Universities, including our, Transform4Europe.

I will be pleased to travel not only to Spain or Germany, but also to Tallinn, Vilnius, Kaunas, and obviously to Katowice, when it is finally possible. Then we will meet again, this time without a microphone or video camera.

M.K.: I’m also looking forward to it. Thank you for the interview.

Prof. Tullia Catalan from the University of Trieste

The University of Silesia in Katowice, together with six universities from abroad, forms a prestigious European University as part of Transform4Europe alliance. Anna Rizzo, a doctoral student of the Doctoral School at the University of Silesia in Katowice in the field of law, took part in work on the project.

Olimpia Orządała: Why did you get involved in the implementation of Transform4Europe project?

Anna Rizzo: I was the Vice-Chair of the Student Government of the University of Silesia. I learnt about the preparations for the implementation of Transform4Europe project during a conversation with Prof. Tomasz Pietrzykowski, Vice-Rector for International and Domestic Cooperation. I decided to take part in the initiative. The subject of internationalisation is very important both for me, and for the University of Silesia, so I agreed to cooperate in the consortium.

O.O.: What do you think about the Transform4Europe project? What do you expect from it?

A.R.: The potential of the project is enormous. Although there are different and numerous internationalisation efforts, e.g. Erasmus+ programme addressed to students and academics, Transform4Europe allows for much closer cooperation between universities. In fact, we are becoming a “superuniversity”. This is not just about us, the University of Silesia, but about all universities in the consortium, which have become a unity. Our cooperation will be very close and at a high level. Academic exchange of students and the possibility to conduct e.g. one subject in cooperation with a number of universities is something extraordinary. These are options provided by the “superuniversity”, a new unit which has not been named yet.

O.O.: “Superuniversity” is an international campus.

A.R.: Yes. This is also one of Transform4Europe assumptions – to form an international campus. Our work on forming the consortium was in progress before the coronavirus pandemic, the global situation was different, but there were already the ideas to create an online platform where everyone could be part of one big academic family connecting students, doctoral students and employees of these seven universities.

O.O.: What can Transform4Europe project offer to students, doctoral students, employees and the University itself?

A.R.: I think that, apart from internationalisation, the project will allow the academic community to expand the intellectual horizons, because the universities which form the consortium are different. We have academies of art, classical universities, technical universities, which allows us to create interdisciplinary scientific bonds.

O.O.: The project also enables us to build the European identity.

A.R.: Definitely yes. This is the spirit of the project, although I prefer to look at more down-to-earth things that could bring the concept of Transform4Europe closer to each member of our academic community. I think that in the future there will be more possibilities to make use of this international cooperation. First there were talks on forming the consortium, now the implementation work stage has begun, but it’s already worth talking about the project, so that we wait in tension and excitement for what Transform4Europe brings us in the future.

O.O.: What have you learnt thanks to working on the project so far?

A.R.: Patience [laughs]. When you cooperate with other people, you must learn to be more flexible. For me international cooperation is an inherent element of the academic life, but I’ve learnt to look at other people’s ideas in a more open-minded way.

O.O.: What sort of experience have you got when it comes to such type of cooperation?

A.R.: Already as a student I had the opportunity to cooperate with different universities and I made a lot of friends and acquaintances during numerous international conferences. Additionally, my dad is Italian and in fact I’ve never lived in a single place for too long. In my opinion, the concept of nationality is dying these days, because we are becoming inhabitants of the so-called global village. We can go abroad and get to know new people who are very similar to us, despite coming from different cultures.

O.O.: Why is it so important for students and doctoral students to get involved in Transform4Europe project? Can we say that thanks to it they will have impact on the future of Europe?

AR: Definitely yes. Such involvement influences the way we think about other countries and allows to overcome stereotypes that distort out perception of other nations. Transform4Europe gives the possibility of shorter mobilities, not necessarily semester-long, like in case of Erasmus+ programme. I think that it’s definitely important for students. A majority of us think that yes, we do need to know the language, but we see mobility as holiday. It’s worth getting to know people from other countries, who may bring a lot to our scientific life. Students and doctoral students may develop a lot if they are open to our consortium partners.

O.O.: How would you encourage other students and doctoral students to get involved in the implementation of goals related to Transform4Europe project?

A.R.: We only study once and it only depends on us how we use it. Nowadays, it doesn’t make sense to study just for the sake of studying: we need to do something more and get involved in all initiatives. I know that pro publico bono work is not currently popular, but gaining new skills and getting to know other people may give us a lot in our future job, which is something I found out many times. An entry in our CV saying that we have taken part in an international project shows that we are open to new challenges.

O.O.: Thank you for the interview.

Anna Rizzo is a doctoral student of the Doctoral School at the University of Silesia in Katowice in the field of law. She took part in the talks concerning the preparation of international project Transform4Europe, under which the University of Silesia, together with six other universities,, forms a prestigious European university. | Photo from the archive of A. Rizzo